|CNC Machine - or a very expensive Dremel engraver|
if you are afraid of it or don't know how to use it.
Firearms manufacturers (true gunsmiths) use the CNC machine to take a piece of blank steel like this and turn it into a 1911 frame, like below.
The gunsmith then uses the CNC to mill (cut from steel) your slide. These are the primary components of the 1911 build. They represent the heart and soul of the 1911.
A parts assembler, however, does not use his CNC to actually build firearms. To a parts assembler, the CNC is nothing more than a very expensive engraving machine - a Dremel that costs $25k.
A parts assembler ignores the CNC and buys a frame and slide set from a real gun manufacturer - such as STI, for instance. He then assembles the parts into a firearm. He may even be a decent painter. Proof? If you own a III Arms (WV) 1911, look at your frame and see if it is an STI frame or a III Arms frame.
When we discussed launching III Arms on this blog, we discussed hiring a real gunsmith who would build firearms. Sadly, I made a mistake and we ended up with a parts assembly guy who could do a decent paint job. We all agreed that III Arms would be the first of several business venture to use profits for the Citadel. Mea culpa.
However, III Arms has survived my initial personnel mistake. The first 1911 from one of several new professional gunsmiths arrives in about 6 weeks. It will NOT have 'STI' stamped on the frame. In the next week or so Holly will also announce a new facet of III Arms that will be noted as a milestone in the 2A world. Holly has put together a brilliant twist to build III Arms into more than merely a firearms manufacturer.
III Arms is still standing, and stronger than ever.
Acta non verba.
**For III Patriots who purchased a III Arms (WV) 1911 and rec'd an STI frame/slide, I take the position that you did not receive what you were promised. In due course Holly intends to announce a buy-back or trade-in for those of you who want to own a genuine III Arms 1911 - as you were promised.
If anyone can't see through this B.S., especially the seventh paragraph, they are an idiot.ReplyDelete
Sorry, Anon - real men and women have proof and can back up their words. In this case, those 1911 owners need only look at the frames of their III Arms (WV) pistols and see if it says 'STI' on it. That is NOT what they were promised.Delete
That's called proof. Screw the insinuations, half-truths and gratuitous assertions. Show your work/proof or STFU.
When HK learned III Arms (WV) was shipping STI frames/slides, she lost her shit - for good reason. She has already made it right with one III Arms (WV) 1911 owner, and she'll do the same with any others who feel as if they didn't receive what they were promised. That's just one mess being cleaned-up because a .Gov employee was hired to do a Patriots job.
Losers lose. Liars lie. Haters hate.
But good people provide proof, and they make it right even when others have done wrong.
If I went to Sears and bought a craftsman wrench and it turned out to be a piece of shit because sears su contracted It out and doesnt own any tool forge or wrench manufacturing facility, whos fault would it be? In my opinon its damn sure not the sub contractor, its sears. And I dont wanna hear no shit from sears running down the sub contractor THEY CHOSE AND DIDNT USE ANY QUALITY CONTROL. Just stfu and fix it. Rooster108 bmDelete
So - if the sub contractor told Sears X would be made to X specs, and delivered to substandard level, you don't think the sub-contractor failed to deliver?Delete
STFU I will not - Fixed, it is...
Of course they failed to deliver. But I bought a brand name wrench from sears. I dont give a shit what who promised who. I bought something based on a brand from sears and ultimately they are responsible because they own the brand. Rooster108bmDelete
And Sears would step up and fix the issue with you, while replacing the poorly-performing sub-contractor with a sub that actually delivers what was promised. This is exactly what III Arms has done. I don't see where you and I are in disagreement.Delete
Sears would not bitch and whine that its not their fault. They would man up, fix the problem and then handle the sub that didnt meet the specs agreed too and lost revenue in court. Rooster108bmDelete
III Arms takes full responsibility - that's what this post is about. It also explains why happened - which customers have a right to know. It also explains how the problems have been fixed.Delete
The thing that bothers me is that ive heard sears bitch more than the customer. RoosterDelete
And 'this' Sears intends to stay ahead of the customer service curve, handling problems before they become problems.Delete
Rooster - are you even a III Arms customer?
Me thinks Rooster is just another wagon rider...Delete
I'd say "Rooster" is doing exactly what his moniker implies...Delete
He hasn't got a single 'egg' in his basket, but he does lots of flapping and f^&*king around...
And you don't think you have eyes in the wire.ReplyDelete
Of course there are eyes inside my wire. There are eyes inside all our wires. That is why we feed them dye packs. That is also why my enemies have only insinuations, half-truths, gratuitous assertions, and convenient omissions - and not one single person who can show proof that K somehow wronged them.Delete
I'm not that guy.
Rooster. Who are you and why do I have to ask that? Why have I NEVER read your 'nom de punkass' until now?ReplyDelete
Fucking really? You post anonymous and ask who I am. Why do I have to ask who you are? Ive read lots of shit from anonymous fuckers like you. RoosterDelete
Rooster/Daryl - relax. We know you are just another anti-K lemming with no personal gripe with me that you can document. You aren't a III Arms customer - you probably just like the camel toe peddler. That's ok - You simply represent the worst of people who self-identify as III.Delete
Seriously k? Why not post what I said last night? Im not a poo flinger by no means. If you think im the enemy you are in a sad state of affairs. I said what I said as business advice, afterall you are just running a business right? Rooster108bmDelete
I've posted everything you sent - at least everything in the queue.Delete
No sir. You most definitely have not.Delete
Dude - I'm telling you the queue is empty, and I don't censor posts. So - resend it, because it obviously got lost in the ether. Sign it.Delete
staying ahead of the curve is what's it's about... just my $.02 worthReplyDelete
Moreover, unlike that cancerous sackReplyDelete
of shit mikey who has carried out
attacks of communist terrorism against
our Republic, enthusiastically partying
in his cesspool of treason and sedition,
this blog does not censor the criticism,
disagreements and opposition of any
and all commenters.
And you will most certainly not find
the moderators of this blog fabricating
comments of support and pretending
those comments were written by
independent, albeit "Anonymous"
Are you by chance looking for any more Machinists? I have about a decade of experience, manual and CNC. Looking to relocate to a more patriot-friendly area.ReplyDelete
What was your speciality? If K doesn't need you get in touch with me at email@example.com and might be able to find work for you in MT...Delete
I don't have anything here full time at the moment - and I'm not sure what kind of income you could get in this AO. I hope to need several machinists/CNC operators soon - I'll put out a call (or send me an email with details) when I know I can give you a steady income.Delete
If you are looking at Houston, there's a shop by me looking for a CNC guy.ReplyDelete
Ah, so you draw the line between assembler and gunsmith at milling the frame? Do you ream your own chambers? Do you rifle your own barrels? I bet you don't. I bet you buy completed components just like everybody else shy of major houses like FNH who can pay for the care and feeding of cold forge hammer lines, and assemble them into your gun like everybody else.ReplyDelete
If buying baby's first CNC (Tormach is wonderful for hobbyists - real manufacturers get actual heavy iron and servo motor production equipment, not lightweight stepper motor equipment) and cutting the frame from billet stock makes you feel like a badass with a big swinging dick, then go ahead, feel good about yourself. It's a good skill - having an 07 in your AO with stock to equip the locals is a damned fine thing to have.
Don't get cocky though. Bragging about your entry level CNC might impress the uninformed, but you just look silly to those in the industry.
It isn't about the Tormach versus the Haas or any other machine, and you know it, so don't change the subject.Delete
It is about having a tool that can do the job for pennies on the dollar, especially in a Post Sandy Hook environment when STI was charging nearly $900 per set, when you could even get them at all. Yet the tool was in the workshop and the steel was available - and not being used for the purpose it was purchased.
And, no - most manufacturers do NOT buy their frames from the big houses - they mill them in-house, either from blanks or even 80%. How many Colt 1911s roll out of the factory stamped STI? Zero.
I have to second the Tormach comment. That is not a machine I would count on for a lot of production.Delete
First of all it has 3 axis not 5. This means lots of screwing around with jigs, registration pins and creating multiple files.
You could have bought a used Haas for the same money with 5 axis and automatic tool changer on ebay.
Nothing wrong with STI frames. They work. I doubt that you will get any better quality (and more than likely worse) with the little Tormach on a entry level 3 axis machine.
You could have just bought a couple Harbor Freight Bridgeport clones for 2500 each, throw another 1000-1500 at it for a CNC conversion and been better off.
Nothing wrong with STI frames at all - and nothing wrong with using them, UNLESS your customers have been promised something else.Delete
The Tormach is an entry-level machine, that will do entry-level work until the business can upgrade. That was the business model. Many semi-custom and custom shops use the 1100. A few hundred units each year is sufficient. Even our first FFL raved about the machine.
But - that was then. ;)
Just for my edification and curiosity. What about barrels? Are barrels being made for III Arms weapons?ReplyDelete
And please, don't talk derogatorily about STI anything. Those are top of the line guns. Worth every penny paid for them. III Arms would do well to emulate them. :-)
Barrels: Not the issue. Making barrels in-house was never an option for start-up - making frames and slides was the plan and the promise. That's why one buys a CNC at start-up - because frames and slides are easy to mill from stock, especially in a parts-depleted post-Sandy Hook.Delete
And nobody denigrated STI on this blog. In the absence of a gunsmith who is capable of doing his own fucking work, an STI frame and slide is a good option.
Good. STI is your standard to beat.Delete
And you're not making a total product until you're making the whole enchilada.
III Arms never claimed to be making the whole enchilada - but the entire reason for investing in the CNC was so it could make slides and frames from day one, in-house, by the 'gunsmith'.Delete
That didn't happen. That problem has been corrected by the III Arms team.
You do understand that the quality of a firearm is totally in the after manufacture of the weapon and a refusal to not allow said weapon to leave the factory until is has been put through it's paces?ReplyDelete
I understand many things - especially keeping one's word.Delete
That's solid. :-)Delete